tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post967178336570145631..comments2024-02-27T00:41:15.985-06:00Comments on AdoptionTalk: Adoption & Ancestry IImalindahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06233439015219192874noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-30310676496348792412010-09-19T14:15:00.104-05:002010-09-19T14:15:00.104-05:00Hi!
I know this is kind of an old post, but I jus...Hi!<br /><br />I know this is kind of an old post, but I just came across it and really wanted to share. I'm an archaeologist, and one of the things I study is ethnic identity in the past (like, WAY past- Bronze Age!). There's an anthropologist I really like, Manning Nash, who talks about ethnicity as not being one single thing, but having various building blocks, including "the body, a language, a shared history and origins, religion, and nationality". (That's from the book 'The Cauldron of Ethnicity in the Modern World', if you're into reading a very technical, dense book on the subject). <br /><br />Anyway, I thought thinking about ethnicity in this way might be helpful to you and your daughters. You could talk about how some elements are shared, and some are different, and how ethnicity isn't just a yes-or-no subject.Brigdhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09171052253976346226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-39933298505253106812010-08-28T13:38:06.906-05:002010-08-28T13:38:06.906-05:00I spent a lot of time this summer doing genealogy....I spent a lot of time this summer doing genealogy. For me, the main part of the fun is doing the research and solving "puzzles." It is equally enjoyable to research my brother-in-law's family, who are not related to me by blood at all. (And who he and his family could care less about as far as I can tell.) So, I think it's possible for adoptees to gain the same enjoyment from learning about their AP's ancestry. But just like there are people in my family that dont' care about that, my children may not care about it either. I would LOVE to be able to find out my adopted children's ancestry as well. It occurred to me this summer that finding birthparents is just one more "puzzle" to solve... it's very important and probably difficult, but something I am increasingly interested in doing. By the way, I have read how some AP's (e.g., Brian Stuy) don't ask or tell their children about their quest for information about BP's. I don't really get that. I have asked both my children (age 7 & 12)if they are intersted in finding their birthparents. Their response is like "sure, that's fine with me." I don't sense that they have a burning desire to do so, but they certainly don't seem opposed to it either. I don't think they understand (nor do I, frankly) all the ramifications of searching and potentially finding birthparents. But should I decide to search, at least I have some inkling about their level of interest.<br />Sue (aka anonymous)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-80107385895997871242010-08-28T09:09:50.682-05:002010-08-28T09:09:50.682-05:00I don't know what to say about my ancestry any...I don't know what to say about my ancestry any more. I spent 50 years going with my adoptive parents history being french and swedish. Now somehow I am supposed to figure out how to be german and Irish. Now neither one feels real and I find myself just avoiding the topic or changing what I say. Neither makes me feel very good.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-38259727835087107542010-08-27T09:42:09.340-05:002010-08-27T09:42:09.340-05:00Ah, the fun subject of ancestry. Personally, my a...Ah, the fun subject of ancestry. Personally, my adoptive parents' ancestry does not seem authentic to me, but I'm not interested in researching my biological family's ancestry either. Maybe I have always avoided ancestry because it makes me feel uncomfortable or it has the potential to cause pain to others? However, I do enjoy pointing out to my siblings who are biological children that I do not share genes with my "eccentric" uncle but they unfortunately do ;)Jennahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00751297800522832117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-59691390862492722742010-08-27T01:01:59.503-05:002010-08-27T01:01:59.503-05:00Nothing to add, I just wanted to say: Great post!...Nothing to add, I just wanted to say: Great post! Interesting, thought provoking comments, as well.No Bamboozle https://www.blogger.com/profile/07931712484017829352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-41264870340462332492010-08-26T21:48:34.946-05:002010-08-26T21:48:34.946-05:00Oh and I might add that while my family tree and s...Oh and I might add that while my family tree and stories are pretty straightforward - lots of intermarriage will do that to a tree - my husband's is messy. Lots of dying parents, fostering, adoption, criss crossed lines and confusion about who really is who. But his family deals with it in the additive. With his father's family we celebrate a whole host of Christmas traditions that have us eating lots of huge meals, usually all in the same day, to get everyone's traditions in. Perhaps there should be a limit to what can be added? <br />And yeah, my girls get all of that plus their own and if they ever have partners - exponential?Elainehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10383760837701581819noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-86301121873958069042010-08-26T21:37:32.615-05:002010-08-26T21:37:32.615-05:00I've been thinking a great deal about these th...I've been thinking a great deal about these things in the past months - working at a blog post/paper - because my oldest daughter has become suddenly very interested in 'family stories' from my family. I happen to know lots about my ancestors related to some of my research and have plenty of stories to tell. It is quite different for me to tell these stories to my daughter than it was to tell them to her older cousins (my sister's biological kids). Why? <br />I'm beginning to think of adoption along the lines of marriage re: family and family stories. When I married my husband I became part of his family and gained some kind of ownership of his family stories (which I actually know better than he does). They are not my biological family or my biological ancestors but they are the ancestors of my family. The same goes for my children. If adoption worked the way it should our family would have 4 distinct sets of family stories/ancestries/genetic codes that we would share somehow as a family, each of us maintaining ownership of our 'own' stories. Families constructed as "Imagined Communities" of a sort. <br />Problem is, of course, that my girls were stripped of their family stories/ancestry/genetic codes so what they bring is an unknown. Adoptive parents try to fill in that unknown with "culture" but really, what is missing isn't "culture" it is ancestry. Chinese culture camp is a poor substitute in many ways. <br />So I hope that my girls can hear the stories of my greatX whatever Grandfather who refused to take up arms to kill Native Americans or my grandmother who regularly talked with angels and make them their own stories in some way. I also hope that some day we can add real family stories from their own biological families.Elainehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10383760837701581819noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-1470382323475556902010-08-26T19:56:37.756-05:002010-08-26T19:56:37.756-05:00Sorry for the multiple posts, it said it wasn'...Sorry for the multiple posts, it said it wasn't posting.Jeff and Madelinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07330454830153579449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-40444957412930248272010-08-26T19:55:53.482-05:002010-08-26T19:55:53.482-05:00I've been thinking about this a lot too. In t...I've been thinking about this a lot too. In the biological sense, no she is not related to Mr. Lincoln, but in a cultural sense--she is. <br />I agree wholeheartedly that M is Chinese and her ancestry is Chinese and if, and when, she wants to claim our ancestry she has every right too. You are spot on that she should never claim ours in whole. To deny her birth ancestry is just wrong on so many levels--and no, it is not the same as when a non-adopted person wants to forget they are related to some of the people of in their past or present because as we know it is denial in thought only, the blood line still runs.<br /><br />But that is the point isn't it. I have many ancestors that I happily acknowledge, so does Jeff. His bloodline to Lincoln is interesting and one most would fine positive; however, there is another bloodline just as strong that runs close along the lines with the KKK. Does he claim them, hell no! My point is that yes, there is much determined by ancestry...there is also much determined by culture. <br /><br />imo--yes, she is related to both. She is absolutely Chinese and that ancestry is hers by birthright. She is also very much a part of our ancestry, not by blood but by our actions as parents raising her into our cultural heritage. We celebrate holidays in ways that our families have for years, so does she. She is absolutely just as much a family member as any other at the extended family dinner table...as much as our husbands, wives, children, step-children, half siblings, etc...we all share cultural ancestry by the way we live our lives and share those moments together. Does that deny her birth heritage...no. <br /><br />The point is one does not deny the other. There does not have to be a choice. In "Adopted" Jen's words ring hard on the ears "I am and I'm not". It is this divide that she is their family and yet outside those family doors she is not that should make us all take pause. Her birth ancestry has been denied by family and embraced by society. Her adopted ancestry has been embraced by family and rejected by society. Until both can be accepted as valid and embraced at whatever level she chooses, how can that statement not be true? "I am and I'm not". <br /><br />By coming to the place that we recognize that we are all who we are due to nature and nuture (not one or the other), we can understand that ancestry is not just DNA. They are both valid, they are both essential in belonging. Again, imo, this is where our society is getting it wrong. A child adopted into the home is not the same as having/raising bio children; however, they are not to be treated as not a part of the family. Telling a child they cannot claim your ancestry is doing just that. <br /><br />WendyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-56617174029650487712010-08-26T19:55:18.359-05:002010-08-26T19:55:18.359-05:00I've been thinking about this a lot too. In t...I've been thinking about this a lot too. In the biological sense, no she is not related to Mr. Lincoln, but in a cultural sense--she is. <br />I agree wholeheartedly that M is Chinese and her ancestry is Chinese and if, and when, she wants to claim our ancestry she has every right too. You are spot on that she should never claim ours in whole. To deny her birth ancestry is just wrong on so many levels--and no, it is not the same as when a non-adopted person wants to forget they are related to some of the people of in their past or present because as we know it is denial in thought only, the blood line still runs.<br /><br />But that is the point isn't it. I have many ancestors that I happily acknowledge, so does Jeff. His bloodline to Lincoln is interesting and one most would fine positive; however, there is another bloodline just as strong that runs close along the lines with the KKK. Does he claim them, hell no! My point is that yes, there is much determined by ancestry...there is also much determined by culture. <br /><br />imo--yes, she is related to both. She is absolutely Chinese and that ancestry is hers by birthright. She is also very much a part of our ancestry, not by blood but by our actions as parents raising her into our cultural heritage. We celebrate holidays in ways that our families have for years, so does she. She is absolutely just as much a family member as any other at the extended family dinner table...as much as our husbands, wives, children, step-children, half siblings, etc...we all share cultural ancestry by the way we live our lives and share those moments together. Does that deny her birth heritage...no. <br /><br />The point is one does not deny the other. There does not have to be a choice. In "Adopted" Jen's words ring hard on the ears "I am and I'm not". It is this divide that she is their family and yet outside those family doors she is not that should make us all take pause. Her birth ancestry has been denied by family and embraced by society. Her adopted ancestry has been embraced by family and rejected by society. Until both can be accepted as valid and embraced at whatever level she chooses, how can that statement not be true? "I am and I'm not". <br /><br />By coming to the place that we recognize that we are all who we are due to nature and nuture (not one or the other), we can understand that ancestry is not just DNA. They are both valid, they are both essential in belonging. Again, imo, this is where our society is getting it wrong. A child adopted into the home is not the same as having/raising bio children; however, they are not to be treated as not a part of the family. Telling a child they cannot claim your ancestry is doing just that.Jeff and Madelinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07330454830153579449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-57359862346502298552010-08-26T19:54:53.428-05:002010-08-26T19:54:53.428-05:00I've been thinking about this a lot too. In t...I've been thinking about this a lot too. In the biological sense, no she is not related to Mr. Lincoln, but in a cultural sense--she is. <br />I agree wholeheartedly that M is Chinese and her ancestry is Chinese and if, and when, she wants to claim our ancestry she has every right too. You are spot on that she should never claim ours in whole. To deny her birth ancestry is just wrong on so many levels--and no, it is not the same as when a non-adopted person wants to forget they are related to some of the people of in their past or present because as we know it is denial in thought only, the blood line still runs.<br /><br />But that is the point isn't it. I have many ancestors that I happily acknowledge, so does Jeff. His bloodline to Lincoln is interesting and one most would fine positive; however, there is another bloodline just as strong that runs close along the lines with the KKK. Does he claim them, hell no! My point is that yes, there is much determined by ancestry...there is also much determined by culture. <br /><br />imo--yes, she is related to both. She is absolutely Chinese and that ancestry is hers by birthright. She is also very much a part of our ancestry, not by blood but by our actions as parents raising her into our cultural heritage. We celebrate holidays in ways that our families have for years, so does she. She is absolutely just as much a family member as any other at the extended family dinner table...as much as our husbands, wives, children, step-children, half siblings, etc...we all share cultural ancestry by the way we live our lives and share those moments together. Does that deny her birth heritage...no. <br /><br />The point is one does not deny the other. There does not have to be a choice. In "Adopted" Jen's words ring hard on the ears "I am and I'm not". It is this divide that she is their family and yet outside those family doors she is not that should make us all take pause. Her birth ancestry has been denied by family and embraced by society. Her adopted ancestry has been embraced by family and rejected by society. Until both can be accepted as valid and embraced at whatever level she chooses, how can that statement not be true? "I am and I'm not". <br /><br />By coming to the place that we recognize that we are all who we are due to nature and nuture (not one or the other), we can understand that ancestry is not just DNA. They are both valid, they are both essential in belonging. Again, imo, this is where our society is getting it wrong. A child adopted into the home is not the same as having/raising bio children; however, they are not to be treated as not a part of the family. Telling a child they cannot claim your ancestry is doing just that.Jeff and Madelinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07330454830153579449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-43399424624889002362010-08-26T19:54:18.421-05:002010-08-26T19:54:18.421-05:00I've been thinking about this a lot too. In t...I've been thinking about this a lot too. In the biological sense, no she is not related to Mr. Lincoln, but in a cultural sense--she is. <br />I agree wholeheartedly that M is Chinese and her ancestry is Chinese and if, and when, she wants to claim our ancestry she has every right too. You are spot on that she should never claim ours in whole. To deny her birth ancestry is just wrong on so many levels--and no, it is not the same as when a non-adopted person wants to forget they are related to some of the people of in their past or present because as we know it is denial in thought only, the blood line still runs.<br /><br />But that is the point isn't it. I have many ancestors that I happily acknowledge, so does Jeff. His bloodline to Lincoln is interesting and one most would fine positive; however, there is another bloodline just as strong that runs close along the lines with the KKK. Does he claim them, hell no! My point is that yes, there is much determined by ancestry...there is also much determined by culture. <br /><br />imo--yes, she is related to both. She is absolutely Chinese and that ancestry is hers by birthright. She is also very much a part of our ancestry, not by blood but by our actions as parents raising her into our cultural heritage. We celebrate holidays in ways that our families have for years, so does she. She is absolutely just as much a family member as any other at the extended family dinner table...as much as our husbands, wives, children, step-children, half siblings, etc...we all share cultural ancestry by the way we live our lives and share those moments together. Does that deny her birth heritage...no. <br /><br />The point is one does not deny the other. There does not have to be a choice. In "Adopted" Jen's words ring hard on the ears "I am and I'm not". It is this divide that she is their family and yet outside those family doors she is not that should make us all take pause. Her birth ancestry has been denied by family and embraced by society. Her adopted ancestry has been embraced by family and rejected by society. Until both can be accepted as valid and embraced at whatever level she chooses, how can that statement not be true? "I am and I'm not". <br /><br />By coming to the place that we recognize that we are all who we are due to nature and nuture (not one or the other), we can understand that ancestry is not just DNA. They are both valid, they are both essential in belonging. Again, imo, this is where our society is getting it wrong. A child adopted into the home is not the same as having/raising bio children; however, they are not to be treated as not a part of the family. Telling a child they cannot claim your ancestry is doing just that.Jeff and Madelinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07330454830153579449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-68142009814664754582010-08-26T17:37:50.675-05:002010-08-26T17:37:50.675-05:00People always ask about each others background, yo...People always ask about each others background, you know, the "what are you?"<br /><br />As an adopted person I've always replied that I'm adopted and my family's background is blah blah blah. I always also say I think my biological background is blah blah blah.<br /><br />To me, I'm both. I completely agree with Sandy. I am related to everyone my family is related to, of course.Campbellhttp://campbellscoup.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-32146498676373456362010-08-26T15:22:09.698-05:002010-08-26T15:22:09.698-05:00It is very complex and for each adoptee to decide ...It is very complex and for each adoptee to decide who they claim.Having borrowed a family history most of my life I was very pleased eventually to claim my own ancestors and it gave me solid ground to stand on that no ammount of borrowing ever did.Vonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17421069895155350144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-75593012066122136442010-08-26T13:18:32.529-05:002010-08-26T13:18:32.529-05:00What a concise and thoughtful post; I spotted your...What a concise and thoughtful post; I spotted your blog via another's and the topic caught my eye.<br /><br />Thank you for sharing your insights as they are reflective of my own and of the same issues our family faces.<br /><br />Our daughter has been asked for the first time this year to do a "family tree" at school ~ it was hard to sit back a bit and simply wait for her to collect and then share her vision for how she wished it to be.<br /><br />In the end she combined aspects from her own Ukrainian/Kazak. backgroud, as well as, my Irish/Swedish, my husband's English and our son's Taiwnese.....she said as one family we all shared equally of those heritages.<br /><br />I almost cried with joy, but wisely kept my poker face in place, such as it is! LOL<br /><br />In some ways she intuited all the big and important nuances all on her own....and she can't wait to share it with her class.<br /><br />I realize this simplifies the issue........and might only work for a 7 year old....and yet I see within it something right and fitting ~ at least for our girl!!Lisahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13185447510541745836noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-89446146707029982522010-08-26T12:48:18.680-05:002010-08-26T12:48:18.680-05:00This is an interesting topic. I have researched my...This is an interesting topic. I have researched my geneology and have lots of pictures, census forms, military registrations, etc. printed out and stored in binders. Right after I adopted my girls, I stopped working on this. It felt exclusive of them and wrong somehow. As the girls have gotten older, the binders have been pulled out and discussed with varying degrees of interest. Sometimes its, "Wow, your great great grandma is UG-LY." And sometimes its, "So, that's our great grandpa, huh?" <br />Of course, I'm willing to share as much as they want. And they seem to feel free to take or leave my family tree as they wish. But I think their connection with all those old dead people is felt with me - as in, "that's OUR ancestor." I'm sure it all will keep changing as they get older.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01406219542747608807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-316191265933534655.post-49303458403110279352010-08-26T11:29:14.395-05:002010-08-26T11:29:14.395-05:00Just as I have two mothers and two fathers I have ...Just as I have two mothers and two fathers I have four distinct sets of ancestors - two adopted - two biological. I have done three of my four geneologies back as far as I can and once the 1940 census is released I will do the fourth.<br /><br />The person I am is because of my biology and the biology of my ancestors.<br /><br />PLUS<br /><br />The person I am is because of who adopted me and who they are is because of their ancestors.<br /><br />So combined I am who I am because of all 4 parents and their ancestors and I claim them all because I am an adoptee.<br /><br />It is circular.Sandynoreply@blogger.com